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Post by SaginawGensFan on Oct 3, 2008 19:39:04 GMT -5
2-1 in the 2nd. Chappell with the Spirit goal.
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Post by thepuckman on Oct 3, 2008 20:01:16 GMT -5
London dominated the first period. Saginaw dominated play in second. McRae goal should have never happened. Bochek cannot let the center move around him on the draw without the puck leaving the dot. Just can't happen. That could spell the end tonight.
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Post by thepuckman on Oct 3, 2008 20:59:51 GMT -5
Saginaw dominated the third period of play as well, pulling to within one goal. Maybe if they decided it was a good idea to play once they got off the bus, instead of waiting for something bad to happen, they might actually win a game like this.
That said, Pasquale needs to play better. A couple of softies tonight really cost us.
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Post by tuppura on Oct 4, 2008 0:05:19 GMT -5
Wow, great quotes in the paper...calling out Pasqualie. I agree with Coach Watson, its time he started playing a bit better - he didn't help.
Listening to the game - I felt like we had two different teams there...
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Post by eaglei12 on Oct 4, 2008 0:15:50 GMT -5
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Post by newguy on Oct 4, 2008 16:01:34 GMT -5
Wow, great quotes in the paper...calling out Pasqualie. I agree with Coach Watson, its time he started playing a bit better - he didn't help. Listening to the game - I felt like we had two different teams there... Boy, we read those quotes differently. He was not, in my interpretation, knocking Pasquale. He just said it wasn't brilliant and he didn't stand on his head. What Watson is hinting at through 5 games already when he uses phrases like "it could be a long year", is that there isn't a lot of talent on this team. No team in the West had more goals walk away from its roster than Saginaw did. Not the Sault, not even Sarnia. And nothing was done in the off-season to replace all the departed goals. Every good team and GM has a contigency plan in place in case some of their more talented 20 year-olds don't return. And in the case of Ryan McDonough and Jack Combs, there wasn't one. And if you think the two Europeans are up to snuff, and that they're just waiting to jump off the page like the previous Europeans did, well I would bet that's not going to happen. Szwarz has a "specialness" to his game. Murovich works his tail off. Beyond that, there's not very many offensively gifted players on this team. They'll all "work hard". They'll all "slug it out", but this team is the least-talented team we've had in Saginaw since the team Moe Mantha finished up coaching in 2003-04. As much as I like Crawford, Brodie, Comrie. They're pretty good 2-way defenders. None of them are as offensively talented as Patrick McNeill was in his 2nd year in 04-05, and none can QB a powerplay particularly well. Look - some of you don't like it, but this lies at the feet of the GM. He coasted off the gifts left behind by Mancini last season, and now his footprints are all over this team. Watson's coaching like crazy, but the talent isn't there to score goals and win too many games this year. But to revisit the point, Pasquale's fine. He won't be an issue, and I don't believe Watson called him out. It lies at the feet of the general manager. |
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Post by donjohnson on Oct 4, 2008 16:41:30 GMT -5
boy, lot of good points there...the only one I disagree with is the "least talented team". There are a lot of GOOD players here and obviously i emphasize the word good. What the team needs is 1 or 2 GREAT players which they don't currently have. If you add Combs/McDonough to this group (especially the talented dmen), this team instantly becomes a contender for the division and conference. Take them away and we're a middle of the pack team.
newguy, i'll ask you directly and others can respond as well...two questions:
1) Do you think we should have made a trade at the deadline with Combs and/or McD even if we weren't getting equal value for 2 100pt scorers?
2) Should we be trading away some of our talented Defensemen right now for a 19-yr old established point scorer? For example, i've heard rumors that many teams would love to acquire Brodie.
you criticize the GM (and rightly so i think) but play GM and tell me what you think we should do.
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Post by newguy on Oct 4, 2008 18:34:30 GMT -5
Don, great post. I always like interacting with people who are passionate about the game and know the league. That might be fair. They have "good" players. Or at least they're "good to mediocre". My fear is there's very little upside with certain players, and it may be too early to name names, but the two Europeans are a concern. I wrote in the summer that I didn't think they'd do well in the Euro recruitment process because Edwards doesn't know the league, and doesn't have the connections. Halliburton left all that to Mancini. And let's face it, Mancini's Euro guys LEAPED off the page at you. I remember the first time I saw both Kvapil and Mursak play, and they were instant threats. Mursak had that incredible point streak to start his rookie season. These guys, Svoboda and Jarusek don't look too good so far. That's simply my interpretation. Contrary to what others would have you believe, if you tell me you think they can play, I can't tell you you're wrong and I won't insult you, but you won't convince me. As for what I'd do if I HAD been Edwards, because it's clearly to late to save his run, and it will not last any longer than the end of this season when his contract is up. Given that hockey ops meetings are currently being held WITHOUT him being in attendance, and given that he and the Head Coach don't speak and nearly violently detest each other, the gig is up. And firing him now and bringing in another GM any earlier than the day after the end of the season, will once again mean two GMs will be on the payroll. I would have moved McDonough at the trade deadline, yes. I think he's a bit of an opportunistic player, whose game translates to a lot of regular season points, but his playoffs in 3 seasons with Saginaw, and PLENTY of icetime haven't translated well. 2 goals, 5 assists in 14 playoff games for Saginaw, and if you look, none of the goals really impacted the result of a game. When they needed a big goal against the Soo, two years ago - he scored none. But his market value was high, and a great opportunity was missed. We weren't going to beat the Soo. Plain and simple. And we certainly wouldn't have beat Kitchener. We didn't win a game in the playoffs with him, so how many could we have possibly won without him?  I would have kept Combs. Like the kid a lot, but you had to hold out some hope, you can keep one of them, and maybe he does come back. Mancini filled this team with players who made other players BETTER. Think about that statement. Player X makes this player he plays with BETTER. We have one such player here right now. Jordan Szwarz. That's it. Murovich is good, but does it all through hard work. Not exceptionally skilled, but he'll get his goals. Szwarz is the only offensive talent any other GM would be eyeing. He's also the only untouchable on this team, as a result. I would move a D-man. Crawford might bring you the most. Windsor or London would salivate to get him. And unlike last year when the deal with Belleville was so badly botched that a 2nd round pick wasn't brought back, I'd make certain a 2nd and 4th or 5th came back, along with a young 2nd year scoring forward. Take either Yogan in Windsor or Kerbashian in London. I'd make that deal. This could be easily misunderstood. I'd trade Crawford not because I think he's lousy. But because he ISN'T lousy. He's got the best market value, and put it this way: Crawford wouldn't exactly balk at getting out of here. I've talked enough to the family to know this is the case. He's going to keep playing hard if he's here, but he's well aware of the circus that playing in Saginaw can be for the last 3 years. And the GM/Coach who placed the faith in him to draft him in the 1st round was sent to the curb so unceremoniously -- don't think that doesn't impact whether he wants to stay or not. He was particularly close with Ian Herbers, and that dynamic is in play as well. As for other moves....feel free to ask. I'd like to know your opinion of the questions you asked me! Thanks! |
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Post by sensspiritfan on Oct 5, 2008 22:03:23 GMT -5
Newguy wrote:
As much as I like Crawford, Brodie, Comrie. They're pretty good 2-way defenders. None of them are as offensively talented as Patrick McNeill was in his 2nd year in 04-05, and none can QB a powerplay particularly well.
It's tough to judge how good one of these three are compared to McNeil when you look at the talent of the players on the ice with them.
McNeil had some fairly decent players to work with. Look at the scoring of all the players that were available for the PP ( Ryan McDonough and Combs did not get much PP time on those teams-- so they were more talented than the Spirit are now-- thus more points ).
I think that the PP has been doing an OK job but the finish is just not there yet but hopefully it will come.
Newguy wrote:
Watson's coaching like crazy, but the talent isn't there to score goals and win too many games this year.
If this were true why do you have 2 rookies on the ice when we are down by 2 goals with 1 minute to play? Looked to me like the coach gave up and called it a night with a minute left. I know I'm going to hear they need the experience but the coach is there to try to WIN games not give up like he did IMO.
Don't be too quick to discredit any of these three, give them a chance it's only 6 games in with a relatively new team
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Post by igive2 on Oct 5, 2008 22:07:20 GMT -5
As much as I like Crawford, Brodie, Comrie. They're pretty good 2-way defenders. None of them are as offensively talented as Patrick McNeill was in his 2nd year in 04-05, and none can QB a powerplay particularly well.
Neither of the three were the first pick in the OHL draft either!
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Post by sensspiritfan on Oct 5, 2008 22:24:06 GMT -5
It was great to see Allicock go after Kerbashian after he tried a cheap shot on one of the Spirit Dmen.
We did not have this last year and it would have come in handy a couple of times.
Great to see Kain finally get a chance to play- I think he will surprise a few people this year- he can play as well as fight.
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Post by newguy on Oct 5, 2008 22:34:04 GMT -5
As much as I like Crawford, Brodie, Comrie. They're pretty good 2-way defenders. None of them are as offensively talented as Patrick McNeill was in his 2nd year in 04-05, and none can QB a powerplay particularly well.Neither of the three were the first pick in the OHL draft either! Agreed. I like them all. No one's saying they SHOULD be as offensively gifted as McNeill, I'm just explaining why one of them could be made expendable, and how we're probably worse off than we were five years ago, when we weren't very good then anyway. Although Watson can outcoach Mantha in his sleep. |
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