Who's Drinking the Kool-Aid?

[donjohnson]

I'm curious to see where everyone stands on the potential trades out there with the big three (Daniels, McDonough, Combs) now that the following has happened:

1) Daniels has been well above-average for the last month
2) The team is on a 6-game winning streak
3) Combs was selected player of the week

I will go on the record and say that at least Daniels should be traded at the deadline this year. If I was the GM, I would also be shipping McDonough out as well this year. I still think we can make the playoffs and Eddie seems to be really solid in goal to perhaps steal a series from someone.

Why ship 2 of 3 you ask?

Well, you just need to look at what happened with Williams and Mursak. If we had traded them last year when they were dominating, we would have struck gold...rather, we had to settle for a near equal trade that doesn't do a lick of good in the short term (although lots of good long-term). Yes, McDonough "could" make a great OA but he could also lay a big egg, get injured, etc. The way the OHL is cyclical, we need to start building for 2 years out now.

However, like i said originally, I am curious to see what the rest of you think and to find out who's drinking the "we're on a 6-game streak and we're going to win the division" KoolAid.

[SaginawGensFan]

I kind of like Kool-Aid sometimes.

[spiritfan8]

We are not going to win the division--that's not Kool-Aid, it's LSD.
But I am impressed that you can tell Pasquale is good enough to steal a series after seeing him in two games..................

Having said that, if anyone didn't learn about how worthless it is to wait for "next year" by seeing what happened to London's grand plans this year.........I would love to go back and read the (literally) hundreds of posts on the NOOF from Londoners that London should sit back and do little or nothing at the trade deadline last year because THIS year, with Kane, Gagner, Mason, etc they were going to be unbeatable. Well, they got one out of three. And they sure aren't unbeatable, although Mason certainly helps. Point being, much as I would like to see McD and Combs back next season, there is no guarantee that will happen, for any number of reasons. A bird in the hand, etc. If the right deal comes along, jump on it.
Which of course leads us back to a discussion on what, exactly, is "The Right Deal". It's a never-ending circle.........

[sailordog]

Well DJ Im not drinking Kool Aid and think that we can win the division, BUT I do think we can make a reasonable run at the 6th (or even 5th) seed in the playoff race. For that to happen I personally would NOT break up the MZC line which is contributing 144 points while all the other active forwards are contributing 99 points.
we would HAVE to get something pretty special for McDonough or Combs

I would not mind getting something for Daniels while he is HOT and playinig pretty well

[sailordog]

SF 8
Combs and Mcdonough aren't exactly Gagner and Kane.

I do agree with your point . Just need to get something pretty darn good.

[donjohnson]

admin said:

I kind of like Kool-Aid sometimes.

i just like when the koolaid man bursts through the brick wall ;D

[sailordog]

just like when the koolaid man bursts through the brick wall

Does He still do that??

[aj0512]

I am torn of whether or not we should make some trades at the deadline, or stand pat.

To be honest, I don't really see why we should trade away our top scorers, our #1 goalie, and team leadership when we've won 6 games in a row and in the middle of a playoff race. Are we going to win the OHL title this year? No. Are we going to catch the Soo or Windsor for the division title? Probably not. But I do think we have the ability to win a playoff series and/or surprise some folks, much like the Soo did last year.

I think McDonough would be a good OA. He's put up solid numbers in his years here in Saginaw, and injuries could happen to anyone. What if we trade McDonough for Player A, and Player A gets hurt? It works both ways.

A player I think could be traded is Sinfield. Our defense has played well as of late without him in the lineup. Perhaps he could be dealt to a contender for a mid-to-late round draft pick.

The jury is still out on Ryan Daniels, but his stock is rising. Sorry DJ, but I don't see how you can call Pasquale "really solid" when we've seen him twice, once against the worst team in the league.

In conclusion...there's no other way to say it, I'm glad I'm not a GM. If we stand pat, then so be it. But if we make some trades, we better be getting some very good, young talent in return.

[IGive1]

I don't think they do a whole lot by the deadline. If another GM wants to get stupid and give up a couple 2nds and something else for an '88 goalie like Sarnia did, well then I think you have to do it. Pasquale needs to play 2 of the next 3 games before the deadline to see if he is for real. If he does not play that many, I think it means they are not trading Daniels by the 10th.

I think Combs and McDonough would be great O/As next year. Neither are good enough for the AHL and the ECHL option is always going to be there if they come out this year or next. No one else is scoring consistently as of now, so if DE moves either of them, he is saying he is happy finishing 8th and more interested in next year and the year after.

I don't think they go far into the playoffs since their offense is concentrated in one line. They can be negated during the playoffs.

Notice how the winning streak started with the last trade on 12/9? Me thinks one of the players who left took a lot of issues with him.

The team is playing as good as they can. I don't think anyone is saying this is a talented or deep team. Sure they are playing teams depleted by WJC and injuries, but that's not the Spirit fault. They should be beating these teams during this period and they are. It's all good.

If they don't make any trades I think the current line up (Sinfield out injured) returns next year, without Daniels and Smith. O/As, Combs, Chappell and McDonough.

[bpfox]

The bottom line here is, and always has been, who do other teams want and what are they willing to give up to get them. The Spirit do not need to do anything so I say only pull the trigger if the deal is simply to good to pass up. Let's look at who won't be here next year:

Zaborsky - Some team might be willing to pay big price For Tomas, but as an import player, he has limited marketability just like Mursak. That said, he means a lot to the Spirit for the balance of this year and so must bring a high return or you just have to say, no thanks.

Sinfield - He is an injured overager who I doubt will bring much of an offer. The team gains nothing by trading him. He will finish his career in Saginaw.

After the two overagers the only other guy on the team who has a good chance of not being here is Daniels. If he keeps playing the way he has lately, Ottawa is going to want him playing at a higher level next year. There are some real questions out there regarding the goalie situations with some of the contenders. Could Oshawa find the price for Mason to be too high and opt to take a chance with Daniels? What about Kitchener? Again, the Spirit do not need to move Daniels, but a "too good to turn down" deal might just make the difference.

I will be surprised to see either Combs or McDonough delt. Call it a gut feeling. Chappell and/or Smith might be throw ins on a multi player deal but I don't see Saginaw including any of it's younger players.

I'm getting this feeling that Don Edwards is taking the approach of improving the Spirit down the road without pulling the plug on this season. I think it's smart to keep a team this year who is good enough to make the playoffs. The young guys will need that experience.

Never been a big fan of Kool Aid. Peace.

[donjohnson]

just an FYI with regards to my opinion of Eddie Pasquale...my definition of "solid" is probably different than most, including my wife who i've had to explain it to as well. To me, really solid probably means "pretty decent" to most others. Yes, it doesn't equate, i know, but "solid" is my buzzword that i equate to anything of average value. Just like when someone says cool, they're really saying OK (otherwise they'd say awesome, or if they're in the generation below me, "tight")

back to hockey, my opinion of pasquale is based on three things, positioning, speed, and "dominator(hasek) factor". IMO, I think his positioning is solid (there's that word again), his speed (up and down) seems to be pretty good, and the "dominator factor" (ability to make the near-impossible save) is slightly above average. Note: "dominator factor can be skewed by bad positioning . So, when I said Pasquale is "really solid", he's a middle of the road goalie (currently) however I will still contend he could steal us a playoff round.

[teamspirit08]

I'll have a large cherry Kool-Aid (my fave), and I'll pour another here...

Many believe that this is the best dressing room this club has had in six years the club has been here. Watson even referenced it in the Snews after the Windsor game.

I wouldn't mess with good chemistry at this point.

From what I've seen from Daniels both on in synch and at home games, he's staying - unless a major offer of solid 17 or 16 year old players is made.

Watson believes you need two solid goaltenders (see Plymouth) and he has brought that theory north on 75 with him. You need a tangible threat as a backup to push the #1 and since Pasquale was added, Daniels has elevated himself considerably.

McDonough and Combs should stay. They would make a great pair for a run this year and another one next year. Both need to prove to the higher levels that they are leaders and this is a perfect situation to do so - not sit on the 2nd or 3rd line in a place like Kitchener, London or Oshawa.

Sinfield has to stay. He's the only defenseman on the club that coming into this season had more than one year of OHL experience.

Coming into the season Williams, (46 games in 1 year), Breen (64 games in 2 years), Brodie (20 games in 1 year), Crawford (63 games in 1 year), Comrie (rookie), Ogilvie (rookie) and Sol (rookie) had only 197 games experience between them at the start of the season.

Saginaw currently has the youngest blueline in the OHL and have helped contribute to a goals against average of just 2.54 since Sinfield got hurt on November 24th.

In the 24 games prior to Sinfield's injury, the team GAA was 3.75.

Even without Sinfield's experience, the unit is solid and has been a key to the club's success all season. Sinfield must be kept for his experience down the stretch.

Unless a major offer falls out of the sky for Daniels, keep him the unit they have right now.

[sagspiritsfan]

teamspirit08 said:

I'll have a large cherry Kool-Aid (my fave), and I'll pour another here...

Many believe that this is the best dressing room this club has had in six years the club has been here. Watson even referenced it in the Snews after the Windsor game.

I wouldn't mess with good chemistry at this point.

From what I've seen from Daniels both on in synch and at home games, he's staying - unless a major offer of solid 17 or 16 year old players is made.

Watson believes you need two solid goaltenders (see Plymouth) and he has brought that theory north on 75 with him. You need a tangible threat as a backup to push the #1 and since Pasquale was added, Daniels has elevated himself considerably.

McDonough and Combs should stay. They would make a great pair for a run this year and another one next year. Both need to prove to the higher levels that they are leaders and this is a perfect situation to do so - not sit on the 2nd or 3rd line in a place like Kitchener, London or Oshawa.

Sinfield has to stay. He's the only defenseman on the club that coming into this season had more than one year of OHL experience.

Coming into the season Williams, (46 games in 1 year), Breen (64 games in 2 years), Brodie (20 games in 1 year), Crawford (63 games in 1 year), Comrie (rookie), Ogilvie (rookie) and Sol (rookie) had only 197 games experience between them at the start of the season.

Saginaw currently has the youngest blueline in the OHL and have helped contribute to a goals against average of just 2.54 since Sinfield got hurt on November 24th.

In the 24 games prior to Sinfield's injury, the team GAA was 3.75.

Even without Sinfield's experience, the unit is solid and has been a key to the club's success all season. Sinfield must be kept for his experience down the stretch.

Unless a major offer falls out of the sky for Daniels, keep him the unit they have right now.

I can see Daniels getting traded simply because I really dont think they can rely on Pasquale and Lepera fully next year. You cant judge Lepera on half of a game. And the spirit dont have any other goaltenders in line for the back up position once Daniels leaves. Watson brings his theory up I75, then what is he going to do next year because he wont have that tandem? This year obvisously isnt there year with 4 main contenders in the Western Conference minus the Spirit…

Are you so naive teamspirit08 to believe that Sinfields removal is the reason why the team has started losing? Or could it be the removal of the worst defensive defenceman in the OHL …. NIIIIIIIIGEL WILLLLLIAMS … Either that or you totally forgot

[bpfox]

sagspiritfan, did you mean to say that you "can't" see Daniels being traded, because if you didn't, then your comment does not make sense to me. And if you didn't mean to say "can't", they your comment does not make sense to me either. Keep in mind, regardless of what happens this year, Daniels is most likely not back next year. Keeping Daniels, means keeping him for the balance of this season only and getting nothing in return. Trading him means taking your chances this season and letting the chips fall where they may to improve the team for the next couple of seasons. I'm not saying which is the best way to go, but I am asking, based on this premiss, which way do you go?

[spiritfan8]

sailordog said:

SF 8
Combs and Mcdonough aren't exactly Gagner and Kane.

I do agree with your point . Just need to get something pretty darn good.

;D ;D ;D Wish they were!!!! Our thread would be taking a whole different direction then!!
We are in agreement. Don't rule a trade out, but don't give them away because of age, and don't blindly keep them because of "next year".